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Gunatics Trusted Vendor brokenarrowtactical.com
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey Daniel, I'm finally here.

Here are some pictures of the Springfield Armory Socom 16 with the new Troy MCS stock assembly. My friend wanted me to show pictures of the Troy MCS in action during a monthly range training for the Richmond P.D. This stock is a main competitor to the Sage stock systems for the M14. In essence, the Troy MCS turns the handling of the M14 rifle similar to the M4's (with some added weight).

More info for the Troy MCS system (www.law483.com)



















 

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Is that Matt Burkett shooting in the last picture with the front cover of the Trijicon taped over? Its a good training technique
 

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Gunatics Trusted Vendor brokenarrowtactical.com
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
ORCA said:
Ooooh!!! Very nice!

+1 for your first post here ;)

Yeah looks to be heavier then a Sage EBR due to the Monolitic Upper Rail. Are there BUIS with it?
The Troy BUIS were still back ordered.

The MCS lower half with a VLTOR Collapsing 5 position carbine stock, Tango Down Grip and 1 TD panel weighs 3lbs. 1oz (actually 3lbs. 0.8oz) which is less than an E2 stock with hardware.

MCS Top and Bottom: 3lbs 12.3oz
MCS Bottom Half: 2lbs 2.6oz
MCS Top Half: 1lb 9.7oz

GI Birch Stock without handguard 2lbs 10.8 oz

GI Birch E2 stock with hardware: 3lbs 6.3oz
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Gunatics Trusted Vendor brokenarrowtactical.com
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Ducman said:
Is that Matt Burkett shooting in the last picture with the front cover of the Trijicon taped over? Its a good training technique

Yup, that was Matt Burkett. He was conducting his own training session at the adjacent range. He heard us training with our entry guns (M4's and 11.5 carbines) and came over to see. He was showing some of my co-workers how the BAC (BIndon Aiming Concept) works by taping up the ACOG's front lense. He was impressed with the Troy MCS, and he stated that the MCS handled better than the Sage, and was faster to index towards the varies targets we had.
 

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Very nice, and welcome aboard!

The Socom 16 will most likely be my next "expensive" toy. Already have all the mags for it, just time for the rifle. lol


Very nice pics, and I have to say that I'm a little jealous! :)
 

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BrokenArrow said:
The Troy BUIS were still back ordered.

The MCS lower half with a VLTOR Collapsing 5 position carbine stock, Tango Down Grip and 1 TD panel weighs 3lbs. 1oz (actually 3lbs. 0.8oz) which is less than an E2 stock with hardware.

MCS Top and Bottom: 3lbs 12.3oz
MCS Bottom Half: 2lbs 2.6oz
MCS Top Half: 1lb 9.7oz

GI Birch Stock without handguard 2lbs 10.8 oz

GI Birch E2 stock with hardware: 3lbs 6.3oz
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Nice! great info!

Yeah I'm with Brucie. SOCOM 16 maybe my next purchase as well.
 

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Gunatics Trusted Vendor brokenarrowtactical.com
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
brucelee said:
Very nice, and welcome aboard!

The Socom 16 will most likely be my next "expensive" toy. Already have all the mags for it, just time for the rifle. lol


Very nice pics, and I have to say that I'm a little jealous! :)
Thanks Daniel!

It's a trip that this Troy MCS transforms the Socom to another type of animal! My other co-workers use the AR-10 type rifles/carbines in 7.62 NATO, and they stated they were surprised that the M14 type rifle modified so, can shoot softer than their ARs in 7.62! As a plus, if you have to hit someone with the stock, and damage it, it won't disable the weapon. :-D
 

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Gunatics Trusted Vendor brokenarrowtactical.com
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Both are great systems.

Sage Strengths
Ability to use stripper clips
Ability to bolt on new shotgun stocks
Ability to retain the GI rear sight

Sage CQB Weaknesses
Sage CQB Weaknesses
Requires replacement of the oprod guide (as designed)
Requires 3 allen screws to secure the oprod guide to the stock (as designed)
Requires 6 allen screws to secure the handguard/scopemount to the stock (new stocks use 5 screws now)
Requires an additional scope mount to place a scope over the action or to mount an ACOG
Requires the use of tube style AR stocks (won't take the A2 or Mag-Pul PRS)
Optics and Iron sights do not cowitness
Cheekrest must be added for scope use and removed for iron sight use
Can't mount a medium heavy or heavy barrel (new SAGE CQB stocks accept a medium heavy barrel without issue)

Troy Strengths
No replacement of the oprod guide
Field strips in seconds without tools
Mounts all optics including the ACOG on the top rail without additional mounts
Mounts all AR stocks including folding stocks and the Mag-Pul PRS except for thumbhole stocks
BUIS are easily added if desired
Optics and Iron sights cowitness in the same plane
Mounts all barrels up to a Krieger heavy barrel
Barrel and stock in-line for reduced muzzle rise

Troy Weaknesses
Can't use stripper clips
Can't bolt on new shotgun stocks
Can't retain the GI rear sight
BUIS are not included
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BrokenArrow said:
Thanks Daniel!

It's a trip that this Troy MCS transforms the Socom to another type of animal! My other co-workers use the AR-10 type rifles/carbines in 7.62 NATO, and they stated they were surprised that the M14 type rifle modified so, can shoot softer than their ARs in 7.62! As a plus, if you have to hit someone with the stock, and damage it, it won't disable the weapon. :-D

Good point about the stock, I never thought about that! Yeah, def a downfall on the AR system. :)
 

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How did you find the balance of the Troy? The Socom that I had was nice balanced in its stock config, but with the rails it was very front heavy, making tranisition slow and heavy.
 

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Gunatics Trusted Vendor brokenarrowtactical.com
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Ducman said:
How did you find the balance of the Troy? The Socom that I had was nice balanced in its stock config, but with the rails it was very front heavy, making tranisition slow and heavy.
As far as balance, the stock Socom 16 is more neutral in feel. The Socom 2 (with the rail and gadgets) feels more front heavy.
A Sage equiped M14 is about the same as a Socom 2. The Troy set up isn't as much. When compared to SOme of my co-workers M4s with all their gadgets on it, the Troy MCS Socom is about the same weight, but it's firing a more powerful round (7.62 X 51 Nato). It doesn't take much to get use to it.:cool:
 

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Ducman said:
How did you find the balance of the Troy? The Socom that I had was nice balanced in its stock config, but with the rails it was very front heavy, making tranisition slow and heavy.
You can buy little lead weights most places that sell fishing supplies. I can never remember the name of them but they're flat and long ranging in size from the size of a match to the size of a heavy wire tie. We cut the and glue them pnto our stocks to balance them the way we want.
 

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hey bob -

there is so much cool stuff lying around in that pictar - especially the coffee pot! LOL
 

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Gunatics Trusted Vendor brokenarrowtactical.com
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
bobturismo said:
that's because it was the civilian version of the sage stock

damn noobs



the military version is f4st3r!

How do you know if the Sage stock was the civilian version???

By the way, it was a military version, that was tested. All the R.P.D. officers that helped with the testing, stated that they preferred the MCS over the Sage.

Don't get me wrong, I like the Sage stock alot, but the MCS fills a specific need/purpose for what we (R.P.D.) are using the firearms for.
 

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Gunatics Trusted Vendor brokenarrowtactical.com
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Originally Posted by BrokenArrow
and he stated that the MCS handled better than the Sage, and was faster to index towards the varies targets we had.


bobturismo said:
that's because it was the civilian version of the sage stock

damn noobs

the military version is f4st3r!

Bobturismo - That quote above was from Matt Burkett (professional shooter / trainer).
What's up with the "damn noobs" line???
 

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BrokenArrow said:
Originally Posted by BrokenArrow
and he stated that the MCS handled better than the Sage, and was faster to index towards the varies targets we had.





Bobturismo - That quote above was from Matt Burkett (professional shooter / trainer).
What's up with the "damn noobs" line???
I was just drunk, joking around. It's just that the navy dumped 10 MIL into developing that stock, that's all. I'm sure that the MCS stock does really well for what they do, not actually crawling on a beach and all...

I'm sure this "Matt Burkett" guy is a good shooter or whatever, you all seem to know who he is, I never heard of him. Like, he's been shooting for 20 years and backed by a major manufacturer or somethin? Like an ex-SF or somethin maybe?
 

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Gunatics Trusted Vendor brokenarrowtactical.com
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
bobturismo said:
I was just drunk, joking around. It's just that the navy dumped 10 MIL into developing that stock, that's all. I'm sure that the MCS stock does really well for what they do, not actually crawling on a beach and all...

I'm sure this "Matt Burkett" guy is a good shooter or whatever, you all seem to know who he is, I never heard of him. Like, he's been shooting for 20 years and backed by a major manufacturer or somethin? Like an ex-SF or somethin maybe?

No problem. The Sage and Troy stocks do breath new life into the M14 rifle. All great stuff. :mrgreen:

You can check out Matt's site: www.burkettvideo.com
 
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