new Russian M44 Mosin Nagant

4833 Views 21 Replies 9 Participants Last post by einzelherz, Nov 14, 2006

meshmdz

Discussion Starter · May 15, 2006

i love my new mosin m44. came fully stocked with the original bayonet, and has the hammer and sickle stamped/ingraved on the barrel!!! as i said above, it is a mosin nagant, issued to the russian infantry back in the day. when i went down to the shop to pick it up, i looked at it very thoroughly... the bore was suprisingly SMOOTH. it had the cleaning rod on it too, original. i cleaned it and the firearm was looking great. there was no pitting from shooting the corrosive ammo that has to be shot out of it... one good thing about the M44/mosin nagant is that ammo is plentiful and cheap. you have to buy it in bulk though. i buy 440 rounds in a cannister for $44.00. so its very cheap. it shoots the 7.62x54R round. and yes, this round kicks very hard! i have some pics and i will get them up here. god bless.

mesh 8)

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1 - 20 of 22 Posts

Adler

· #2 · May 16, 2006

I have the 91/30, 1942 tula made. Its ok but a Mosin will never be a Mauser.

Jeremy

· #3 · May 16, 2006

True it's no mauser but you can buy half a dozen mosins and enough ammo to have a lot of fun for a while for the price of a decent mauser.

bassplayrr

· #4 · May 16, 2006

My buddy and I share an M44 as a project gun (he owns it but I do most of the work, go figure

) and that thing is a blast to shoot. We recently fitted a scope adaptor (takes the place of the rear-most sight) and 6x scope and she's as accurate as can be at 100-200 yards. Plus, you gotta love that fold-out 'flat head screwdriver' bayonet.

Ever notice that the tip of your bayonet and the tip of the bolt take-down tool are of the exact same dimensions and appear to have been machined on the same equipment? Gotta love that effiecint Russian wartime engineering.

-Chris

meshmdz

Discussion Starter · #5 · May 16, 2006

i agree the mauser is the best action in the world. however, a recent article in shooting times suggests overall performance the mosin is better than the mauser.. better sights, more accurate, longer barrel, etc.. the russians created a fine fine weapon with the M44. the mausers are not more expensive though in my dealings. we got a M48A yugo mauser in a while back and it was about the same price as the mosin yet not in as good as shape. both are great military sniper rifles. i take the mosin over the mauser though. just me.

mesh

Shad

· #6 · May 16, 2006

I, personally, agree with Adler on this one. I think that military rifles built off the Mauser action were top shit. Just putting in my 2 cents.

Adler

· #7 · May 16, 2006

meshmdz said:
i agree the mauser is the best action in the world. however, a recent article in shooting times suggests overall performance the mosin is better than the mauser.. better sights, more accurate, longer barrel, etc.. the russians created a fine fine weapon with the M44. the mausers are not more expensive though in my dealings. we got a M48A yugo mauser in a while back and it was about the same price as the mosin yet not in as good as shape. both are great military sniper rifles. i take the mosin over the mauser though. just me.

mesh

Id love to see that article. The mosin is less accurate, less durable due to its bolt design, and less reliable(exteded magazine). And the sights...well I think the mauser wins there as well. Plus they have a tendancy to suffer from sticky bolt syndrome compared to the mauser.

Basically the mauser has always outperformed the mosin which is an outdated design. The only mosins I have seen shoot better than a stock mauser are uber tricked out Finnish sniper rifles. My unissued Mosin shoots horribly compared to my well used Czech 98/22.

Plus almost every sporting rifle is based on Mauser's 98 action. About the only mauser that shoots on the level of a Mosin is probably the m91.

meshmdz

Discussion Starter · #8 · May 16, 2006

mesh[/quote]About the only mauser that shoots on the level of a Mosin is probably the m91.[/quote]

i think you meant to say something else... yea i would show you the article, it was in shooting times about a month ago. it said mosin vs. mauser. you may be able to find it online on their website... check it out

Adler

· #9 · May 16, 2006

I was reffering to teh 1891 Mauser used by Argentina. It shares some features with the mosin that came out the same year that were later improved upon.

I have never met one expert or seeon one Russian Mosin work nearly as well. The Finn ones arre close with the only better one being the one that they use now for a sniper rifle. However teh only thing mosin left is teh reciever and most of the bolt.

ORCA

· #10 · May 16, 2006

Oh man this is really getting Ad going lol!!! I'm a mauser fan as well since it's the parent of my 03 Springfield.

My buddies been trying to give me his nagant. I guess the rim fire ammo is his biggest gripe.

Adler

· #11 · May 16, 2006

Orca...you mean rimmed case. Rimfire is like a 22lr, 7.62x54R is a rimmed centerfire case. Acutally compared to the Enfields that use a rimmed case, the Nagant feeds better via a cartridge interuptor that keeps the rims of the cartridges from binding on one another.

Like the Enfield the Mosin Nagant and their cartridges are holld overs from the blackpowder era. Thats why they are rimmed. The 7.62x54R is ballistaclly close to the 308 so its good and unlike the 8mm or the 303 its still in service. The problem is with the steel cased laquer coated cases the ruskies and their allies use/used. The laquer burns off a nice sticky residue in the chamber of the gun and makes the nagant suffer from its sticky bolt syndrome, a problem that it has major issues with.

Other problems that make it less desirable than the mauser is the fact it has a multi piece bolt with removabel bolthead. This gives less strength to the design unliek the mauser with its one piece bolt. Combine that with the fact it only has 2 lockign lugs verus the Muaser 98's 2 with a thrid safety lug to prevent injury incase of bolt failure is an important deficency.

Also the Mosin Nagant does not have any gas vent holes like the Mauser so if you get a ruptured case or primer you get a face full of nast shrapnel and powder, the Mauser vents the gas away fromt eh shooter down into the internal magazine.

The internal magazine of the mauser is more reliable because by putting it inside it cannot be damaged by being thrown around by a soldier like the Nagant.

Also the Mauser is the second most widely produced rifle in the world, only slightly second the AK. Over 100 million Mausers were made for various militaries....then add all the sporting guns adn you have the most prolific arm of the first half of teh 20th century.

The Nagant would have a better argument if more countries used it. Only Russia/USSR and Finland used it. The Finns using them because they were part of Russia until 1917. The Mauser saw service in over 50 nations and was the inspiration for many other designs like teh 1903 Soringfield...a design so close that the US Govt lost a lawsuit and had to pay to use the Bolt, Charger Clip, and internal magazine because they were blatant copies of the mauser patent.

The Mosin is more comparable to the French Lebel, Mannlicher Carcano, and Enfiled. These were all its contemporaries. The 1891 Mauser is also comparable, however the performance of the 1893/1895/1896 family as well as the pinnacle 1898 Muasers are all superior in every way.

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Mndfusion

· #12 · May 17, 2006

:twisted:

m44's remind me of pit-bulls... mauser k98's are more like a doberman or german shepard,, hahah.

didint the ruskies cut the bolt in half (2 piece bolt) to get around
Mauser's patent :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:

BTW
no way is a mosin 91/30, m44,or m38 any better than a k-98 -- but a finish m39 is in my opinion, superior.

here's a side by side....

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2

Jeremy

· #13 · May 17, 2006

That article sounds familiar. If I remember correctly, the mosin beat the mauser accuracy wise when they put the 2 guns in a vise with no human factor, juat 1 gun against another.

As far as the mosin sights I believe the claim was better "battle"sights The mauser has much better sights but the big front sight on the mosin is, while not real accurate, easier to see and use and accurate enough to put repeatable hits on a man size target.

Adler

· #14 · May 17, 2006

Were the two rifles in similar condition? Most Nagants are in Excellent to New but most Mausers are well worn.

Also what models were compared? I could see a new condition Mosin Nagant outshooting one of the butchered Turk mausers.

Jeremy

· #15 · May 17, 2006

I believe straight bottom of the barrel surplus guns; in a vise it's just gun to gun. Ammo would also make a big difference. You can't really apply the out come to the guns in general just the 2 tsted

meshmdz

Discussion Starter · #16 · May 17, 2006

mndfusion, i love your mosin and your others you have pictured... fine looking weapons man.

adler, dont get my wrong. the mauser is the best action to ever come across the world. that is no arguable. i will give you that and attest to that from any platform.. however, i like the mosin m44 better because i like the ease of the action's cycling, the better sights, etc, as opposed to the mauser.once again, this is just my preference. both are stellar rifles and millions have been killed with both of these fine war-tested weapons.

Mndfusion

· #17 · May 26, 2006

any k98 can be made to shoot better -- any m44 can be made to shoot better.

1. Glass bed stock for tiight reciver fit again.
2. Lapp locking lugs, not on well worn guns...
3. Lapp the rifles crown, this is the most important part as this is when the bullet leaves the barrel and any burr or mishape will allow bullets to fly out and not group..
4.trigger wk
5. shoot match ammo or reload. If shooting factory stuff trty a few diff. weights and brands b4 buying bulk to see what your gun likes... you can do this yourself when u reload by raising and lowering powder till your hitting 1/4 moa.

Jeremy

· #18 · May 28, 2006

Mndfusion said:
any k98 can be made to shoot better -- any m44 can be made to shoot better.

1. Glass bed stock for tiight reciver fit again.
2. Lapp locking lugs, not on well worn guns...
3. Lapp the rifles crown, this is the most important part as this is when the bullet leaves the barrel and any burr or mishape will allow bullets to fly out and not group..
4.trigger wk
5. shoot match ammo or reload. If shooting factory stuff trty a few diff. weights and brands b4 buying bulk to see what your gun likes... you can do this yourself when u reload by raising and lowering powder till your hitting 1/4 moa.

That stuff for the most part is a waste of time and money on a mil-surp gun. We're talking about a gun worth 50$-200$

1 bedding the reciever doesnt really help here because the guns have full lenfth stocks. most of which have some warping so you need a new stock either sportrized or a carefully inleted full stock

2 lapping in many of these guns, especially the mosins. The metal used isnt top quality lol you never know what is going to happen with it. The densities of the metal vary greatly. So unless your parting out a mauser for a rebuild it's not worth it.

3 the crown don't mean much if the chamber and barrel are worn. With the mosin bayonet going over the muzzle it will damage the crown anyhow so it will need removed

4 trigger work can be done but is very touchy

5 match ammo see #3

All that stuff does work. On a gunthat won't group it's worth a try but the money involevd is to much for a mil-surp gun. A trigger job alone will cost more than the gun. Unless your building a custom off the mauser action don't waste the money. The guns don't shoot that bad. They aren't tack drivers but I have no problem hitting shilouttes out to 250yds with my m44 using cheap ammo,

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Adler

· #19 · May 29, 2006

I shoot the hell out of the smaller clay pigeons at 100 yards with my mausers all the time. I can get 3 inch groups most days with Romanian suprlus 8mm. Now my Mosin is innaccurate as hell...bhut it was made in 42 and it shows.

burnera

· #20 · Nov 10, 2006

i just bought a mosin too.

Shot it without cleaning it from a crappy position at 50 yards.
Got this:

Currently have the gun totally dissassembled getting rid of lingering cosmoline.
Also need to go buy lube and better cleaners.

The stock is worthless! patch job was done up front with biscuits, finish is all coming off, shallack missing in a lot of parts, a few dents from being thrown around.

i paid $120 for the rifle, bag, and 3 boxes of wolf ammo.

i'm considering replacing the stock with a synthetic. opinions?

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