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· Registered
1,881 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
How does everyone here handle not carrying in "alcohol serving establishments"? I personally don't carry in bars and the likes when I take my lunch at work, but sitting down and thinking about it, most restaurants (TGI Fridays, Applebees, etc., etc.)fit the bill of being "alcohol serving establishments". So here's the question, what does one do if out and about and stopping in to get a bite to eat while carrying?

· Premium Member
4,133 Posts
I very commonly carry to places like that as to do so is completely legal in MA.
Not once has a bar maiden come along and forced beers down my throat nor have I had my dining companions brow beat me into having a shot or six or forever lose their friendship or some such silliness. As well not once in doing so have I cracked and succumbed to the evil desires of zee alkiehol.

But hey that's me.

When I am at my inlaws though where they very commonly drink and drink heavily I'll do one of two things.
1) If I know were going there for say dinner then I do not carry. As a personal rule I do not ever carry into their home because they are very much antis and I respect their home & opinion even as I do not agree with it. Also I do not carry into other peoples homes either.
2) If we stop by and it's not expected prior by me then I'll disarm myself, lock my pistol (it has a lock installed on it), and lock that up in a storage bag I keep in the truck for just such cases and then I'll lock that bag too locking it to the truck interior itself (a storage D-ring tiedown).
This past Sunday without prior knowledge by me my wife while we were out decided to stop at her dads house and stay for an hour. I followed the above steps and then entered thereafter. He of course as always offered me a beer. It was just after 2PM. I thanked him for the offer and refused it saying outside of visiting his house I would never think to start drinking so early and we're due to make a couple more stops before we get home.
No fuss and no feelings hurt. Easy.

IMHO the no firearms in establishments that sell alchol/liquor is stupid.
Most every family restaurant we like to hit up (and none of them are chains) have alcohol sales. Same goes for visiting community/town based carnivals, musical events, food tastings, bowling, and pretty much many other normal family & daylight oriented activities.

One of the good things about living in MA (outside of Boston). :D

- Janq

· Registered
4,273 Posts
is it really that cut and dry? if they serve alcahol in any capacity you can not enter with a firearm? i guess i can sort of see the no firearms in a bar rational. most of the bars i go to are packed with people and drunk bastards stumbling about. you cant really ever be in total controll of the items on your person.

but not being able to carry in an applebees because you can order a beer or a glass of wine is a little silly. is there really no distinction between the two?

· Premium Member
4,133 Posts
Yes, in some states it is just that go or no go.
Other states may allow but then require percentage of business calculation like Carney mentioned and then others don't allow it at all.
Then there is VA where concealed carry in an establishment that sells alcohol is forbidden but open carry is legal and allowable at same.
That does one no good though because now you have to either choose not to visit the establishment/event or you advertise to the world including neighbors, friends, coworkers, and predator hyena 'Hey! Here is my gun and I am a gun carrying citizen. Oh, and BTW shoot me first!'.

No thank you. :(

I very much appreciate the way that MA law handles this as I have carried concealed to a number of places and events where alcohol was distributed and not one of my neighbors, relatives/inlaws, nor hyena have known.
Events have included a business meeting that was held over lunch at a local eatery that happens to sell alcohol on it's menu and has a prominent bar. I've been to like 4 or 5 local/town related evening social events where wine and champagne was being distributed (free and in other cases for fee). I've been to multiple family food events and 'Taste of ....' type stuff with my family by day and they all have had alcohol vendors and wine sellers involved. Even going to an evening movie where the theater sells wine & beer amongst it's condiments I've gone without a worry of being illegal.
It's been great to that end, and completely sensible.

Oh and for those who might think oh but Janq who is going to run up on you and/or your family at a town/city fair or as you attend an evening tie & jacket type social gathering?

I'd respond to that with these...

Assault Arrest Made at Church Fair


Seventh Squad detectives report the arrest of a Massapequa Park man for an assault that occurred in Massapequa on Friday, July 20 at 11:21 p.m.

Detectives report that 7th Precinct Police Officers Eugenio Maiello and Shawn Warta responded to a fight at St. Rose of Lima Church Fair, Bayview Avenue/William Street.

Police Officers Maiello and Warta observed Robert Tilearcio of Massapequa Park screaming at a group of people, detectives said. Police Officer Maiello ordered Tilearcio to leave the premises, detectives added.

According to detectives, Tilearcio then placed his hands on Police Officer Maiello's face. Police Officer Maiello again ordered Tilearcio to leave the premises, detectives said. Tilearcio, detectives added, then slapped Police Officer Maiello's face. Police Officers Maiello and Warta, detectives said, went to place Tilearcio under arrest when a struggle ensued. Police Officers Maiello and Warta were able to wrestle Tilearcio to the ground, gain control, and place him under arrest, detectives added.

A Nassau County Police Department Ambulance transported Police Officer Maiello, who suffered an injury to his left hand during the struggle, to New Island Hospital, where he was treated and released.

Tilearcio, detectives said, was charged with Assault 2nd Degree (D Felony) and was arraigned in First District Court, Hempstead, on Saturday, July 21.

Source -
Police officer accused of assault in poolside incident
Associated Press Writer
July 31, 2007 - 7:27 p.m

SAN ANTONIO — San Antonio police have opened an internal affairs investigation into the behavior of an officer accused of using a racial slur and beating a woman who asked him to put out his cigar at a community pool.

Tamara Vaughan, 18, said her jaw was pushed in and she still cannot open it far after an attack by Detective Keith Alfaro, 35, who was off-duty.

Vaughan was hospitalized. She has bruises on her arm that she says are from Alfaro and estimates he hit her 25 times, including putting his forearm on her throat and choking her.

Alfaro was arrested last week and charged with aggravated assault and evading and resisting arrest.

Ed Shaughnessy, an attorney for Alfaro, said the case is pending before a grand jury and that Alfaro has not been formally indicted.

"Hopefully he won't be," Shaughnessy said. He added that his client maintains his innocence but would not elaborate.

The July 22 incident happened at the pool at the housing subdivision where Vaughan lives with her grandmother, aunt and uncle and cousins.

According to a written statement signed by Vaughan, she was at the pool with four cousins when the smoke from Alfaro's cigar began to bother her. When she asked Alfaro, who was on the phone, to put it out, they got into a verbal fight.

Vaughan's statement said Alfaro then used the N-word against Vaughan, who is black, and made comments about Vaughan's appearance, saying "You wanna look like a man, I'm gonna treat you like a man." Vaughan said she was wearing swimming trunks and a T-shirt at the pool. Vaughan, who is a lesbian, said Tuesday she believes Alfaro was attacking her sexual orientation.

Alfaro then allegedly hit Vaughan, who fell to the ground. She said he continued to hit her and then laid on top of her, placing his arm across her neck to choke her. After he stopped, she said she tried to get up but that he then started hitting her again.

During the altercation, Vaughan said her 15-year-old cousin jumped on Alfaro's back to pull him off of her. Afterward, Vaughan's cousin was yelling at Alfaro, who allegedly responded, "I don't speak ghetto, I don't understand Ebonics, speak English."

The incident is being investigated by Bexar County, since it happened outside city limits.

Alfaro's has been placed on administrative duty during the police internal affairs investigation, police Sgt. Gabe Trevino said.

Vaughan and her father met with San Antonio Police Chief William McManus Tuesday, but said they won't be satisfied until Alfaro is off the force.

"The officer at the end of the day got paid for beating me," Vaughan said. "I would love for him to be suspended. Fired. Something. But suspended for right now would be fine."

Source -
Man Assaulted At Movie Theater

By staff

Monday, July 30, 2007

Authorities are investigating an unrelated assault and stabbing that occurred late Saturday and early Sunday in Sterling.

Map data ©2007 Tele Atlas - Terms of Use

In the first incident, the Loudoun County Sheriff’s Office responded at about 11 p.m. Saturday to the Regal Countryside movie theater, 45980 Regal Plaza, in Sterling after a 19-year-old man reported that he was assaulted by three men.

A cell phone was taken during the incident, and investigators are trying to determine whether the assault was gang-related.

All three of the men were described as being in their late teens or early 20s...

Source -

Side note: Before moving to MA I lived in Loudoun County and used to go to this exact same theater in Sterling which for those who are not familiar with the area where the theater is located is not a bad or 'ghetto' area by any measure. The homes there, SF and TH, run $500K and up and the development where this occurred is 'Cascades' which itself is just about 2 miles from Ashburn, VA where several Redskins live and is the headquarters for AOL.
...And it took me just about five minutes total effort to locate these news stories none of them I was aware of prior to this exercise.

Legal concealed carry everywhere and anywhere at any time FTW.

- Janq

"Anywhere, anytime, anyplace, to anyone." - A crime truism

· Registered
1,881 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
All good points. I've been able to carry for a couple of months now, but have only done so on a few occasions for reason of being self-conscious of my weapon printing quite a lot. But now that I feel like I have a couple of holsters that are more concealable, I think I may start to carry a little more often.
Oh yeah, the guidelines of 11 Del. C §1441 are pretty broad. So I think the guidelines you guys have given are pretty damn good, and within the statutory provisions on carry restrictions.

· 10111011
2,980 Posts
Wasn't it mentioned that there is "lesser of two evils" laws somewhere on this forum ?

It was described that if you do an illegal act (such as carrying a gun on premises where it is illegal) but in doing so, you prevent an illegal act that carries a greater sentence (stopping a gun-toting lunatic from trying to shoot up the restaurant you're in).... that this in fact will "pardon" the lesser illegal activity since it prevented a more serious illegal activity.
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